New Role, Bigger Scope: Rethinking What It Means To Lead|Eps 18
Julie Cober Intro:
Imagine if you were invited to a room filled with a collection of the most diverse, interesting, authentic women in business leadership and entrepreneurship today, sharing their stories of growth, courage, risk, and change. Women who've declared enough is enough. These rules of success I've been asked to follow no longer work for me and frankly, who made them up. Anyway, while there is such a room and my friend, you're here in it right now. [00:01:00] Welcome to “According To Who?”, the go-to podcast for successful women who are ready to question the current status quo, do things differently and rewrite her next chapter. I'm your host, Julie Cober, former C-Suite, corporate executive term founder, CEO and peak performance mindset. Coach to the female founder on a mission to build, grow, and scale on her own terms. If you're craving more freedom, wellbeing, and true fulfillment both in your work and your life, [00:01:30] guess what? You're going to love being in this room.
Podcast Transcript:
Julie Cober
Hello, hello, welcome back to According to Who. I am so happy to be here today with my new friend, Karen Gombot. Karen and I haven't known each other very long. We met in a mastermind late last year. And I've said this on the podcast before with a few people. I just love how the universe works in this way. I just find that the universe brings me women that are so similar to me. Karen and I have like,
Karen Gombault
you
Julie Cober
beyond kind of scary, similar backgrounds. And we kind of knew that we sort of energetically connected in this mastermind. And then we discovered more about each other. And it's just so interesting when that happened. So I loved Karen's story when I learned of it. And I knew I immediately wanted her to come join us here on the podcast so that she could share her amazing journey. So that's what we're going to do today. So welcome, Karen. I'm going to start by reading your bio.
Okay, so I read this out so I don't get anything wrong and then we'll just jump into it. Sound good? Okay. Yeah. Okay, so Karen is an American who called France home more than 32 years ago. Before starting in her current business, she spent nearly three decades in international corporate leadership, including time as a CEO. She has led global teams, managed complex stakeholders and operated inside environments where expectations shift quickly.
Karen Gombault
Great, thank you, perfect.
Julie Cober
and decisions ripple while widely. So when she works with the senior leader, she's not speaking, just speaking from theory. She knows what it feels like to carry a role that's both exciting and heavy. She understands the subtle pressure, the quiet second guessing that we all experience and the moments of isolation that rarely get talked about. Today, she brings both perspective strategist and a seasoned operator to the work she does with her clients.
Her approach blends the pace and the pragmatism of a CEO with the partnership and the presence of an advisor you can rely on. She's also certified in positive intelligence, which is a key tool she uses to help clients build mental resilience, emotional regulation, which is so critical, and steady grounded focus. And on a personal note, she lives in France, as we said.
where she builds her days around meaningful work, connection, and well-being. Her mornings start with strong coffee, which I love, mind you too, and a healthy dose of exercise. It keeps her steady, focused, and grounded, and she brings that same intention to the leaders she works with. She believes that when we show up in our full strength and perspective, we raise the standard, right, for ourselves, for our teams, and the work we're here to do. I just...
absolutely love. This is why I wanted Karen to come on to the podcast with that kind of mentality with that kind of perspective on life, then I know you're just going to share gold today. So one of the things we always love to do here at According to Who is I always ask my guests to give a little bit of a high level overview of your career, kind of like the Coles notes up to starting your current business. Because you have so much incredible experience clearly.
just looking at your profile, whether it's on LinkedIn or your website, you're full of wisdom, full of wisdom, you know, in leadership and in teams and all the things we talked about. So can you just give us maybe a high level up to when you started your business so that so there was see where you're coming from.
Karen Gombault
Sure. Sure. Thank you, Julie, and for that wonderful introduction. I'm actually very proud of listening to somebody else read it. It's actually quite flattering. So I, like you said, I've been here 32 years. I came to do my masters, and I started working immediately after that in market research. So market research is opinion polling.
Julie Cober
Yes, you should be.
Karen Gombault
And because I spoke English and I wanted to work internationally, I was hired in an international market research firm and I spent over 28 years in market research. I kind of worked my way up the ladder and I even bought a business. I sold the business and
The probably the important point is that I loved what I did. I loved working with clients and it was international. Like that just fills my cup. And so I just steadily climbed up the ladder taking on after I my business, I went on to a managing director of a business unit in France. Then I went on to several global roles, manage global clients.
Julie Cober
Mm-hmm.
Karen Gombault
I know over 35 countries traveled extensively and left in 2020 to take on, I was managing Europe and then there were company changes. So it was a smaller company ended up becoming the CEO post COVID and navigated the company through a lot of those changes. So yeah, so I have been very active in market research, managing clients in an international environment.
Julie Cober
Wow.
Julie Cober
Right, so clients would hire your firm, whether your own firm or firms you work for, to do market research on their behalf for a various number of topics.
Karen Gombault
Exactly. So it could be branding, could be innovation, worked with all of the big clients. Yes. Mainly in new product development. So a lot of it was for the Nestle and the L'Oreal and the Unilever and the Procter & Gamble and all of those big companies who needed work around product development, innovation, branding, brand strategy.
Julie Cober
Prodigy.
Julie Cober
Okay.
Julie Cober
How to get it to market. Yeah. Okay. Oh, nice. That's interesting. So a lot of marketing, a of marketing, a lot of brand, a lot of, okay, that's awesome. so that's taking you up to April of 2023. And that's where you launched Karen Gamba coaching. So one of the things I always love to ask the women that come join us here is because you know, all of you have years of experience, extensive experience, how very senior roles like all the things you just described.
Karen Gombault
get it
Karen Gombault
Exactly.
Julie Cober
What was your reason for wanting to make the pivot from going, I think about it and I think, okay, 30 plus years, most of the women I meet with, very successful as an employee, right up, so in your case, right up to the CEO. So you're running the whole thing. Like there's no more accountability than that.
Karen Gombault
Thank you.
Julie Cober
And then at some point, somewhere along the line, you say, you know what, think I'd like to do this on my own. Now you did own your own business at one point too. I didn't realize that. So where, what, what was the rationale? Okay. Now I'm going to go out on my own and I'm going to do this other gig.
Karen Gombault
Couple things. Firstly, I was in an industry that's actually market research is not that sexy. It's based on numbers. work with a lot of people who are also, I mean, it's big investment for companies and very don't like change and the industry.
Julie Cober
Mmm. Mmm.
Karen Gombault
It just, I'd been there, done that. I'd been in about four different companies within market research and it was the same topics. You know, being more commercial oriented, having problems hiring, know, simplifying your processes, all of these things, I've done them over and over again. So I simply, as much as I loved the industry, I had a great reputation. I loved all of the people in it, loved my clients.
Julie Cober
Mmm.
Karen Gombault
I just got bored, honestly. And it got to the point where I had another probably seven or eight, nine years to work. And just the industry didn't excite me anymore. Honestly, it didn't. And I pretty much done everything. And like you said, once you get to the CEO position, and I'll say it's not as glamorous as it sounds.
Karen Gombault
it's, you know, it's, took a toll on my health also. And I got to the point where I said, I've got another 10 years to work, to simplify things. And, my father had been a business owner. I, my, my CEO position was in a relatively, a smaller type agency. I loved it. Also, I love that, freedom of, and so.
Julie Cober
No, I would agree.
Karen Gombault
I just want to start my business and I did it also because I wanted to have a life, have a job around my life. I was tired of having a life around my job. And so that was really why. Yeah, it was just time and I felt ready and
Julie Cober
Right.
Karen Gombault
I was ready for the challenge. So that's why I decided to change.
Julie Cober
I love what you said there. I say this all the time. This is another synergy with Karen and I that I just didn't know until now. But when I decided to leave too, that was the exact same thing. used to say, I would hold up my fist and say, this is my job and everything else revolves around it, including my children and my family. And I wanted it to be the different. I wanted my kids and my family to be my fist and everything else revolves around them.
And that's the reason why so many women go, right? Regardless of where they're at in the stage is it doesn't feel aligned anymore. And it's and that what you just said there, too, it's so interesting because I've been doing a lot of deep thinking and deep research for my clients myself on this, because what you said, what you just said around, you know, to me, what I heard was your soul was saying to you.
Karen Gombault
now.
Julie Cober
Okay, I have 10, 15 years left here. How do I want to live this? I don't feel totally aligned right now, especially if you're in a job that's creating health issues, which so many of us have been. You know, it's the way we've been conditioned to succeed, right? The hustle, the grind, the sacrifice, you give it your all, you're traveling all over the world. You know, and again, this is the first thing. That's the expectation. And especially in corporate, I believe is that this
this is the thing and you figure out how to revolve around it. But I think your soul was saying, you know what, I feel like we could live our life and love it and have success and financial success and maybe do something else.
Karen Gombault
Yeah, and I think that I had also started, but the seeds had been planted a while back because I had started coaching on the side also in 2017. And I did that for two years. I did health and wellness coaching and I loved it.
Karen Gombault
but then I decided to change jobs during COVID. And that's why after that job, I decided to really go all in because it also took time to also, because it is about also giving up the travel and giving up the financial security. so it wasn't, I don't wanna say it wasn't, it was an easy decision, but I'd given it time.
Julie Cober
Yes.
Karen Gombault
You know, I've been thinking about it for several years.
Julie Cober
and dabbling in it then. Also, which is a great idea. That's like proof of concept, right? To even say, I even like this coaching thing? Like, so for in my example, I come from HR, I coached my entire career. I know that's why I was put on this earth, right? So but as a brand strategist and an operator and a CEO leadership that, you know, maybe you didn't have deep depth. I mean, of course, as a leader, we coach, right? But this was my life. So I knew that this was just an extension.
Julie Cober
So I can totally understand as an operator where you're really in the analytics and the data and the strategy and the planning and all that side. I think that's smart. You probably intuitively knew, well, let's dip our toe into this coaching thing. You probably intuitively knew, you would be if you made it up to CEO, you're obviously a coach.
Karen Gombault
Yeah, no, did. I actually, one of the reasons why I went into coaching too is because I worked with a lot of women who, so I did, mean, I had, my team was about 170 in my last company, a lot of women, market research is a lot of women, and they needed help. Like that was fundamentally, I'm like, nobody is raising their hand for a challenge. Nobody wants to take on a new project. Nobody wants to apply for this new job. Nobody wants to move to a different country. And I just felt that the women, and this is global, I had eight different countries, like, I'm like, these women need support. And so I had my background was definitely management and just wanting to help women succeed. And so that's really kind of when I went into coaching initially, that was really the driver.
Julie Cober
You can make such a bigger impact if you're focusing just on that. So let's go now. So you've gone out and you've started this beautiful company. I always like to ask to people who have started new companies like you, what was the first 12 months like? Did you wrestle with going back? my God, I've made a mistake. I need to go back. What have I done?
What did that look like for you? Or maybe you were like, nope, this is it. I'm all in. I've got this all in energy and I'm off to the races.
Karen Gombault
Wow, great question. So the first 12 months, couple of things. think, so my father passed away at the beginning of that. And so it took me a while, two things happened that year. So my father passed away at the beginning of the year and then also we decided to move. So, yeah, so two big things and
so that first year, I changed my niche a couple times because I started off doing leadership coaching, then I went to health and wellness coaching. And so that first year, it was, I would say, ups and downs. I never thought about going back to corporate until about a year later.
Like a year later, it still wasn't generating the revenue that I wanted. And I got a call from a headhunter for this amazing job. And so I considered it for about two weeks. But then I was like, I would come out of the interviews, I was almost sick to my stomach. And I was like, like it was physical reaction, negative reaction to those job interviews and what they were saying to me. And so.
Julie Cober
Yeah. Yeah. The expectations and what you would be doing and yeah.
Karen Gombault
And it was, and I was just like, okay, I was tempted more by the money and the status than the work. Yeah. So that.
Julie Cober
Yeah, security. Yeah. Yeah. Oh, isn't it amazing how we can rationalize? Right. And that's the thing. It's a carrot. That was a carrot hung by whomever we want to believe, right? God, source, universe. Okay, are we really serious about this? This is how this works, right? Are we super serious about this? And this is I've been I'm talking to my clients about this lately, what I call all in energy, right? All in energy is walking in full faith that what you're doing is a guaranteed to be successful. That's all in energy. That's all in thought energy, right? And so when we get those things, because you have been so successful already up until this point, and of course, anyone's going to want to hire you. That's a no-brainer with all your experience. But what is it that I want, right? Is the question
And so I love your answer because this is what I coach women on is listen to your body because almost every single person I've coached has been in your shoes. Well, I just got this, you know, and it's not really producing the revenue and maybe they're having pressure from their spouses or all the things, right. And they're panicking. my God, this isn't going to work. And so that thought energy is taking them down a rat hole. And so I never say don't go to the interview. I'm always like, you know what? It's just a conversation. Go talk to them, but listen to your body and o yours obviously was visceral, which is good. Some people's aren't, right? And they have to go. so, depending on who they are and how they process, I always say, sit for a bit here. Sometimes they're totally excited and want to get back. But your body's telling you, your body's going to give you the answer.
Karen Gombault
It was visceral. It was. It was and it did. so that, but those first 12 months, I think it was exciting, but I also had to recover like physically because I had had the reason why I had left is because I had had at least six months of very, very severe insomnia. And so, but I'm also very conscious of my health. So I was, you know, being very preventive about my health in general. And I didn't realize though how much it had drained me. So that first year, it also took me a while to, you know, with a move and there were other things going on also. And it was just that first year was kind of, I would say hard, but I love what you said about go all in energy because I had been so successful. Like every single job I'd went after, I'd gotten every single thing that I wanted to do in life I'd gotten. And so there was no reason why building a business, why I wouldn't be successful. It's simply taken longer than I thought it would, but there's no reason that I wouldn't be successful. And that thought.
Julie Cober
There's no you've already had I say that to all my clients and every woman who comes on here and I want you all to hear this who's listening to it. If you've had success in your life, you have the external proof. We always want external evidence to come through our senses, right? I need to see it. I need to hear it. I need to feel it. Well, if you've been successful, you got it. You know what to do and you know who to be. You've just you're in a different container that's unfamiliar. And we don't none of us type a high performing women like to be unfamiliar, right? We like to know how to do things and da, da, da, da, da. But yeah, there's no reason to believe that you won't be successful, hugely successful because one, you don't even actually need the proof of the past, but if you want the proof, you've already got it, right? So that's the all in energy is the full faith that you can figure this out, that you're gonna partner with the right people that you're going to take the right aligned inspired actions that you know, it's like the certain way that Wallace D. Waddles talks about in the science of getting rich, right? So that's what's the desire? What's the desire? Make sure you're really super clear on that and put it out to the universe, right? What are you thinking? The thought energy is so huge. That's the beliefs like Karen just said, there's no reason for me to believe I wouldn't be successful. That's a really powerful belief. Right? And then there's your identity, which is a big one that most women struggle with, It's like, cause now I'm to an employee and now I'm an entrepreneur. And a lot of the women that I work with, probably you do as well. You might even had to have this happen, but with me, it was a lift and shift. I just started acting like an employee over here in my own business. When you're real, when I, the day I realized, hang on, there's a specific identity that's attached to an entrepreneur and the
Karen Gombault
That was huge.
Julie Cober
The magic in this is that you get to decide what that identity is. Most of the women that I work with say, okay, give it to me, Julie. Give it to me from the textbook. What is the identity? And I'll just be that. It's like, that's not how it works. You get to decide what this entrepreneurial identity is for you. And then you show up as her every day. And every single one of them are different.
Karen Gombault
Yeah, no, it is. It's it. That is maybe one thing I underestimated is the the like you go from being someone who answers every email who, you know, bends over backwards. So if you want a meeting, you've got a meeting. To like your it's crickets, you know, and and just it is it's like you go from being someone to being a nobody.
Julie Cober
or, you know, I'm a part of a big team, the leader of a big team to you wear all the hats. You're it. You're the secretary, the EA, you're the brand operator, you're the CFO, you're everything. You're the procurement officer. You are literally everything until you can hire, right?
Karen Gombault
And you.
Karen Gombault
Yeah, and it is. CFO! And it's, yes, until you can, so it's fun, but it's, it's, you do need, I was ready for it, but it's like you, like you say, it is a very big identity shift and you have to be very deliberate about what you want to be, who you want to be, how you want to show up. So.
Julie Cober
And that's really the work I think in the first 12 months. That's why I always ask this question because myself included. I mean, I was like 11 months in before I figured this out. I'm like, wait a second. It was just like an aha moment one day. I'm like, wow, I have literally just lifted and shifted over here. Even my down to how I managed my calendar. Like the reason I left, which is why you mentioned this too. And I think most people that I work with or speak to want to leave, especially after such a long successful career is freedom. And majority of it is time freedom. Most of us already have decent amount of financial freedom, right? So yeah, would we love more? Sure. But it, we're just tired of having no life from a time freedom perspective, right? That's been my experience. So when I went and shift lifted and shifted, like, I was managing my calendar exactly like I did as a chief HR officer. like, hang on. Why did I leave? Well, because I don't want to work on Fridays.
Karen Gombault
Mm. Yes. 100%.
Julie Cober
I want Fridays off if I want, if I want to take time off in the summer or whatever. So I structured it that that's my CEO day, which means on the days that I do work on Friday, it's very strategic work. It's working on projects or offers or new, you know, no meetings, none. Everybody knows do not block. You know, it'd be it has to be a very specific circumstance because otherwise why wouldn't I just go back and get a paycheck every two weeks? Like I want to build freedom into my calendar, which I want to talk to you about because I love what, you know, what we said in your bio and, you know, what I, what I got most when I first met you and started learning about you was your, and I can see why you would dabble in health and wellness coaching because there's a big connection there, right? When we're stressed, when we're not in our healthy state, when we're living these crazy lives on the hamster wheel,
Julie Cober
I thought about it too, because health is so important to me, because I was in such a depleted state as an executive. I can see why a lot of women think, I'm gonna do health and wellness coaching, because they're trying to get healthy and well, right? But I wanna talk a little bit with you about your philosophy on balance, because I mean, all you have to do is follow Karen on social media, which will give her all the handles in the show notes.
Julie Cober
This woman is balanced, right? And I know it's not just show, where you live is beautiful and all the things, but I loved that part of your bio, the coffee in the morning, the exercise. So I'd love to know your thoughts on that, how that transitioned as you did, and then like, how are you integrating that with your clients now? Because I'm sure a lot of the clients you work with now are in the state that you were in,
Karen Gombault
So I have never had a problem putting myself first. Even in a corporate environment, got to the, you know, I...I would say flirted with burnout and early on, like in my thirties. And so at one point in time, I'd stopped working weekends. That was my big thing. And then, um, I always exercised. So those were kind of two non-negotiables, but yeah. Yeah. I, um, you know, I, I was a big runner. Uh, I ran marathons and so.
Julie Cober
already part of your identity, I would say, right? Yeah.
Karen Gombault
but it got to the point where it still wasn't, I would say it wasn't, I know if it wasn't enough. It was fine, but I was still managing a lot of the stress through emotional eating. And that weighed me down for many, many years. And I just got to the point where, So I'm turning 56 this week.
Julie Cober
happy birthday coming up.
Karen Gombault
Thank you. And I just think life is too short. And there are so many things that I want to do. so today, the way, so my CEO day is Wednesday. I don't take any clients. I don't take any calls on Wednesdays. And I don't start work until usually 10, 30 or 11 in the morning because I also work. I work in the evenings because I work with the US. And so there's several evenings that I'll work until eight. So I work about 30 to 35 hours a week, but I love working. I'm very efficient, but I take a day off if I need to. Like last Friday, we took a day off with my husband and we did all kinds of fun things. So it's just about being efficient, anticipating. I'm super disciplined when it comes to my agenda. And I just don't think that those things are being selfish. I think you can't pour from an empty cup. And so if you don't put yourself first, there's no way that I would have the energy to build a business. And there's, just doing so many other things that, because that's what I think life should be about is the other stuff. As much as I think a job is great, it's just all the other stuff that just makes it so much better.
Julie Cober
Yeah, I always say that I believe that the purpose or anyone's purpose on this earth is to love their life, genuinely love their life and have that supported by work that they truly enjoy. That's the definition, right? To me of a magical life. So okay, let's break that down. Work that you truly enjoy. Okay. So in your case now coaching making an impact. Within that, then you're deciding, like Karen just said, she's laser focused on her agenda. That is well, first of all, it doesn't matter if you're working in corporate right now, if you're listening to this or you're becoming an entrepreneur, you are an entrepreneur, that should be the case in any situation, right? If you want to live a magical life, you can live a magical life still working in corporate. You don't have to leave. This isn't what this podcast is all about. But you have to look at where am I lacking in some boundaries? That's really where the balance comes in, what Karen's talking about. So do you have boundaries in your calendar? Like she said, I decided to take weekends off. Well, yeah. Why are we as corporate executives or in these roles working seven days a week? I did it too. I would be the one at the hockey rink. Someone would say, you know, where's your mom Owen? she's up there. You see the one with the laptop. I had it open and I was working at my son's hockey game every weekend. I'm like, this is great. I got an hour. I can watch him, but I can get out some emails. Like what? Hang on. That's not how we're meant to live. Right. And, and no, I think just one of the things that I would suggest to make it really practical for listeners, and this is what I always advise my clients, is when you look at your agenda, you schedule your personal things first.
Julie Cober
Yes, the big rocks, make them your big rocks, right? And like you said a minute ago, your non-negotiables. Listen, if you're in a executive role and things are hamster-wheelish, as I call it, probably one of the best things you can do, as Karen just said, is get one of your big rocks is some sort of physical activity and you schedule it and nothing can touch it. Like think of people in your life, I say this to my clients all the time, because they're always negotiating with
Karen Gombault
That's it. Yeah.
Julie Cober
health, right? And physical fitness and wellness. I think, think of it's an identity thing. Like Karen said earlier, she's always been a runner. She identifies as a runner. So run, she doesn't negotiate with herself whether to run or not, because she sees herself as a runner. So that's the trick. This is why the gyms are full right now.
Right? Because it's January, we drove by a gym the other day, I said to my husband, oh my gosh, look at that parking lot. Like, it was like, people were driving around trying to find spots and I'm like, 30 days, that thing will be empty. Right? Because they're doing the doing, which is going to the gym, I'm going to work out three days a week and I'm going to get healthy and fit and fabulous, as one of my clients will tell you. Okay. But why is it empty in 30 days? Because they did nothing to change their identity and look at themself as a person that lifts weights and goes to the gym three days a week. They're just plowing through, doing the action. But if we change the identity, because here's the thing too, whether you're a CEO, a C-suite executive, a senior executive, an entrepreneur, health has to be one of your big boulders if you want to survive it. It has to be. You cannot negotiate on this. You have to figure out how to move your body.
Karen Gombault
It has to be, yeah. No, I agree.
Julie Cober
and move through that energy and the stress that comes with it. Like, look at it. Like, yes, Karen and I have a lot of freedom in our lives now as we're building these businesses, but we also have stress. We also have things we have to do. You know, she said I work 30 to 35 hours a week, right? Like, that's a normal work week, right? And we've lost sight a lot of the times, right? Corporate executives, they're working 50, 60, 70, 80 hours in some case. And I hear it all the time. I don't have time. You need to make time.
Karen Gombault
Yes, it's a choice. It's a choice. And I've, you know, I raised two kids and I always put myself first. And I never had a problem with that because you can't pour from an empty cup. It is not selfish. And if you are down and out, then first of all, I thought, I always felt it was important to set an example of what a healthy lifestyle looked like. And
Julie Cober
It's a choice. Not selfish.
Karen Gombault
the food that we put in the body and the movement and like, I went through menopause with flying colors just because it had become a habit and my identity, my health comes first and then the rest, my health comes first before family because it helps me be a better wife, mom, know, friend, employee. So that is like my biggest non-negotiable.
Julie Cober
employee, entrepreneur, everything. Because in the end, remember, like, and I know this is a cliche, but it's a cliche for a reason, right? Like, we know because Karen and I both have had health situations where the stress has gotten to a certain point. Well, in my case, like it was sheer boom panic, a stress leave for nine months, you know, the beginning of it, which I share in my story in episode one not being able to get out of it. thank you.
Karen Gombault
which is amazing. If people haven't, if you haven't listened to that episode, please go back and listen to Julie's first episode. It's amazing.
Julie Cober
Well, I just felt like I needed to tell the story because I know that so many can relate to it, right? Like I literally couldn't get out of bed. That's how debilitated the stress had gotten for me that I let it to your point. You just said it's a choice, right? A hundred percent. That was all thought energy that I have no choice. I'm the primary income earner. My husband has been sick. All the things that all of that was bull, complete bull. I could have changed the job.
Karen Gombault
Thank you.
Julie Cober
I could have said, no, I've just made a huge mistake. This is the worst job of my life. I'm leaving, right? I could have done that, but at the time I didn't think I had the choice. So it's a thought thing that starts it all, right? But I just remember laying in that bed. The only thing I could do is stare at the ceiling thinking, I will never let my health get to this point again in my life. I don't care what I have to do. Cause when you don't have your health, we can talk about, the kids are cranky with the kids, which I was, and you're impacting this, you're not feeling good about yourself here. But if you don't have your health, you have nothing. And think of the people that don't have their health. They would do anything to get it back.
Karen Gombault
And I think as we get older, I mean, I know people now who are starting to pass away and something like that, like never occurred to me before. And which is also why we moved to Southern France, you know, 18 months ago, almost two years ago now, is because we didn't want to wait to retirement. We wanted to take advantage. Yes, you are not guaranteed that. And...
Julie Cober
Right, not guaranteed that.
Karen Gombault
And when I say now I only have what? I don't know, six, seven years left to work. It's like, that is insane. And I fully agree with you that it is a choice and nobody is going to make it for you. That's the thing is no, we think that our company should protect us or, but it's all on you. Honestly, it's all on me.
Julie Cober
No, they're not. Listen, that's the basis. I've said this on this podcast so many times, the basis of the relationship. We make it mean a whole bunch of things, especially when you're in very senior roles. the basis of the relationship, whether you're a CEO or a frontline line worker is you give them a certain amount of hours of your time and expertise and they pay you, period. That's the basis of a working relationship, working for somebody else as an employee. Now we like to...say that we have to do this and if we don't do this, our company will do this and maybe they will, maybe they won't, but those are meanings that you're putting to. all the relationship is, is you give them your, your buy it's time for money, right? As an, as an employee. So why are we making it mean all these other things that are causing us so much stress in our life? That's the question I always say to my clients to ask yourself, right? you know,
Julie Cober
I even and I coach very senior women, right? And some of the questions even lately I've I've thought like in one situation, you know, this woman is a superstar, which most of my clients are. And she's on a mediocre leadership team like they are all operating at mediocrity, including the CEO. And I said to her, OK, so why are you coming to work every day as a Wayne Gretzky when they're all over here? And she was really confused, right? She was really
Are you asking me to not perform? And I'm like, no, what I'm asking you to do is match the energy. And then you can decide, match that energy, which is going to give you a whole bunch of time back into your day. And then you can decide, do I leave? Am I going all in energy on this business that I'm building? Cause she's building a business as well. But you have no time in your life because you're operating as the Wayne Gretzky that you've been your whole career, but nobody else in your company. So why are you?
Julie Cober
And it was like a light bulb moment. just went, you don't have to operate that way. Because coming to work and being a steady eddy and doing all the things you need to do. as this, you know, she's in a chief financial role. That's okay too. You can be super efficient, like you said, in these eight hours. And you'll probably still be operating higher than the rest of them. Right? Anyway, so it's just something, it's perspective. It always matched your energy.
Julie Cober
So tell us how you two big topics in your coaching now with the people that you coach, how do you, how does mindset play the role in your coaching? And I'm curious and you you can just speak in generalities if you'd like to. I'm always curious when I speak to women who are coaching senior leaders, how is it out there right now? What are the big? Challenges that they're facing because I think if there's women listening to this they might not feel alone if they know and they hear that wow other people are facing this too and without giving obviously specifics on your clients but just in general if you can.
Karen Gombault
Yeah, so the mindset piece...
Karen Gombault
course, it's really important and you have touched on that quite a bit today about the identity piece about you can choose your thoughts to choose your perspective.
Karen Gombault
I find that people are really caught up just in, like you say, the hamster wheel and they need, they don't realize a lot of times that mindset is an important part of how they show up at work and how they do their job and what they say no to. So I would say that, At least with the work that I do. So I work mainly with people taking on new jobs or bigger scopes. And so there are some very key strategies that they need to learn also to do. Delegate is a big one. It could be also one of the things we spend a lot of time is focusing on what you can control and what you can't control. So there are some things like that.
that go along with the mindset work. I'll just give you one basic example is people go into a job thinking, I have to prove myself really quickly and to do that, I need to be in all the details. I need to know everything that's going on. But when you're taking like low hanging fruit, but all of the details and get into all of the weeds. But when you go into a very senior position, what you really need to do
Julie Cober
Low hanging fruit, right?
Karen Gombault
is to have bigger picture, to be able to make decisions, take a step back, set direction. And so there's a lot of, I want to say, people are spending their time on the wrong thing. So mindset is part of it, but there are also some very concrete things that people think they should be doing in a new job or a bigger scope. So those are kind of the two things that we spend a lot of time on. And of course, it's that inner work about identity and we've already talked a lot about it today. So that's a lot of the mindset work. What I see in, how is it right now? Honestly, I think it's just as good or just as bad as it's always been. It's, mean, yes, I do find that the geopolitical world is really screwed up.
Julie Cober
Same.
Karen Gombault
And I think that is creating a lot for the United States to be going through what it's going through. That is creating a lot of instability in the world economy. seriously, countries like people in France now don't even know if they can ship something to the U.S. I mean, that's how crazy it is. Okay. Same thing. So.
Julie Cober
Think how what we live, how do think we feel in Canada right now? Right? Like Greenland's up, we're like, okay, what's going on here? So you blinders on but yeah, you're right. It's a ripple effect, right?
Karen Gombault
Exactly. It's a ripple effect, but that is an opportunity to, you can either get sucked into that and go down that doom and gloom. And I do have clients that do that. So we work on it, or you can say, okay, what can I control? How do I stay in my lane? And actually can I see that as a gift or as an opportunity? And so it's also, you know, flipping the narrative. So how's it going right now?
Karen Gombault
think it's been like this, honestly, for the past six years. Since COVID, I just think it's a shit show. I'm sorry for swearing and sorry for the bad language.
Julie Cober
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. No, no, it's true. It's true. I won't delete that one because it's true. It's true, right?
Karen Gombault
And I think that people just need to learn to not take it all on and absorb all of that heaviness. But it's a skill and it's a skill. And the way that I like to see it is like putting a force field around yourself. Kind of like in Star Wars, there's a force field and you have to almost visualize what you have to not accept or not spend your time on.
Karen Gombault
And but yeah, I think it's these past six years it's been.
Julie Cober
Yeah. Well, and you made a really good point. I think this is a good barometer for people to try to practice what you're just saying is what can I control and what I can't control? We couldn't control COVID, right? We couldn't control the shutdown. We couldn't control the breakdown in the supply chains and how long that lasted. couldn't control, you know, we can't, have no control over what's going on geopolitically, right? So allowing yourself to get into a tizzy of stress and look at this is coming from two women who have been there like water let ourself get into a tizzy of stress. So we've learned how to maybe, you know, to your point, I love that I call it like an I think I always say to everyone think of it an Easter egg or an egg over top of you that's it's plexiglass and it's so thick. You can see out but nothing can get through nothing to penetrate. So whatever metaphor you want to use. And that's also matching energy. Like, why would we match energy on something we have no control over? So that's kind of what Karen's saying. And I think is a really, really important point is decide how you want to show up, decide who you want to be. Right? So this is happening. There's stuff happening. There's always going to be stuff happening in the world, right? Like it's always going to be. So how do you want to show up in that? Because that's the choice.
Karen Gombault
No.
Julie Cober
that you have that is, and that is what you can control. That's the only thing you can control, right? And in 100 % it's a decision. So that's like beautiful, beautiful advice. So it's good to hear that it's still pretty much the same out there. And to your Karen's point earlier to stay in your lane, stay in your lane, honestly, it'll serve you so well. And anyway, so I know you have a hard stop. So we have a few minutes. The last question I always love to ask.
Karen Gombault
And it's a decision.
Julie Cober
because our podcast is called According to Who. And what we're doing here, and I think we've had a great discussion about this today, but we like to challenge beliefs, right? Because we believe things that we've, some of the things that we've adopted since childhood, someone told us something and we decided to believe it and it's come through with us through life. And we wonder why we're stuck in certain areas of our life, right? So I would love to know, I always love to know from, former executives, now entrepreneurs, in your time, in your business, you're coming up to three years now, what's the biggest belief that you decided, I have to question this, this is no longer serving me, this must change?
Karen Gombault
I think that...there were quite a few, but. there's so many, Julie. I would say one of the, it's probably around money because I was making really good, you know, really good money. And to tell myself I'll never make that money again, that was probably one of the biggest things that I've had to work on is...
Julie Cober
What stands out for you?
Karen Gombault
And knowing that I had planned financially, but then we decided to move and that was a lot of money. And my business being slower than I thought it would be. So that is the belief is that, because now I really had to work on the possibility that, I can actually be a coach that earns X amount of money a year. But that one… anything around money and believing that I would never make my corporate salary again. And I haven't made it yet. It's only been three years, but it's my objective actually this year.
Julie Cober
Yeah, that's good. So that's the focus you can you can actually make it and surpass it. That's the belief she needs to hold. Even though all the external evidence is showing her I don't have that yet. And if she looks at her bank account or whatever that none of that matters. If you want to actually, you know, bend time and bend reality and move manifest something right, create something. If we believe we're not we're going to make our corporate salary again, we'll guess what's going to happen. You're never going to make your corporate salary again. It's that simple. People, we like to complicate and go, well, that can't be that simple, Julie. No, it is. So that's big because she picked that one and she said she has many and we all do. And then she can decide I'm changing this. And this is the narrative that I'm going to have now in my thoughts and my feelings and my beliefs, right? So thank you for sharing that because that's a huge one for women that are listening to this.
Karen Gombault
Yeah.
Julie Cober
Are you kidding? I can't do this. I have primary income or data data data. Trust me. I know lots of coaches that make way more money than they did as a corporate executive, like way more lots and lots. So if it, and that success leaves clues, right? So if you know someone as well hitch to that wagon and find out what they're doing, not, and not more importantly, not what they're doing because you know what you need to do. Most importantly, who they're being.
Karen Gombault
definitely.
Julie Cober
How are they showing up? All the things we talked about today. What is their identity? Because that's what's making them the money that's more than their corporate salary, necessarily just what they're doing. It's also what they're doing, but it's also who they're being, right?
Karen Gombault
Yeah. No, definitely. if there's one more maybe that I would leave listeners with, because I know they're also building their business, is that I've used to think that was also a right way to build a business. so believing now that there can be my way or there can be different ways, there is not one right way to build a business. And that took a lot of experimenting and work to say, okay, I can build a business on my terms, how I want. And that was also a big one. But again, coming back to the whole identity piece that we talked about is who are you as an entrepreneur? Who do you want to be as an entrepreneur? And being that person before you have the results takes a lot of self trust.
Julie Cober
Totally. Full faith, right? Operating in full faith, like we said at the beginning, that there is nothing but a guarantee of success. That's how we have to operate. Okay, my friend, I know you are on a time crunch. So thank you so much for this. This was amazing. I knew that you would be dropping gold. I know you have to run. So we will get all your handles so that everybody who says, my gosh, I got a... talk to Karen can reach out to her. We'll get her website, we'll get her all the things, we'll put it in the show notes because I know she has a client meeting. Sorry.
Karen Gombault
My podcast. Yes, I have a client meeting and my podcast. I have a podcast.
Julie Cober
Yes, we're going to push Karen has her own podcast, you can reach out to her, you can have a consult with her, can, you know, if anything that resonated, then we'll get that for everybody so that they can follow you or chat with you. Thank you so, so much.
Karen Gombault
Thank you. Thank you, Julie. yeah, word of encouragement also for all your listeners. It's 100 % possible to build your dream life. Just makes, you know, it takes a couple very deliberate, intentional decisions, but anything is possible.
Julie Cober
Yes, 100%. So good. Thank you, Karen.
Karen Gombault
Thank you.
Julie Cober Outro:
Thank you so much for choosing to spend your time with us. [01:18:30] I hope today's insights have empowered you and given you ideas and tools to start to rewrite your rules of success. If you love today's episode, please leave us a review and be sure to share it with a friend. And if you'd like to hear more from these trailblazing women, be sure to hit the subscribe button so you never miss out on another powerful episode. Don't forget to connect with me on LinkedIn or Instagram for daily doses of motivation behind the scenes insight, and to keep the conversation going. For [01:19:00] additional resources and strategies, visit julie cobra.com and subscribe to my newsletter where you'll receive life-changing content delivered right to your inbox. And always remember, you have the ability to create any change you want in your life at any time. You are 100% worthy of living a life that you genuinely love, that's supported by work that you truly enjoy. Keep pushing the boundaries. Question your thoughts. Step into the elevated version of you. [01:19:30] And until next time, always be asking yourself “According To Who?”.
